1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start!

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Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Hello All,
I saw this interesting thread on google regarding the Triumph TSS, so I made the arduous effort of joining Triumph_Talk to hopefully share some info on these interesting motorcycles.

I am the second owner of a 1983 TSS; I made the irrational purchase about two years ago.
For those of you who remember, in the early 1980's, new 4 valve Triumph's were still on showroom floor, but they had very little that was new to offer, or even better than the older models, and the competition was moving on. I remember a new TSS on the showroom floor of Britalia motors in San Jose. It really looked good, and anything of significance would have been enough, but there was dreadfully little info, then and now, regarding the 8 valve triumph. Even to this day, I have never seen a TSS on the road or even in display, excpept for mine.

A quick summary of my bike. I am the second owner, the bike was meticulously maintained, it looks almost brand new, despite having 17,000 miles.
The modifications that the previous owner made are as follows: progressive fork springs, and a slightly larger rear sprocket. It still has the original front tire.

My time working on the bike has been somewhat limited lately due to work and other things, but here is where I currently am on this bike: The electric start worked great for a week and then stopped. After removing the timing cover to inspect, I saw that the sprague clutch was shot. When I removed the timing cover, the intermediate gear fell off revealing a chip in both the intermediate gear and crank pinion. I replaced the crank pinion, however, the intermediate gears are absolutly unobtainable, at least not from any of my sources. I am in the process of converting to a non-electric start timing cover, but I don't trust the timing marks on the timing gears. Does anyone have the cam specs for this bike? I cannot find them anywhere.

Despite the good condition of the bikes external finish, the compression seemed low, about 100-110 per cylinder; however, it does not smoke. When I inspected the valve clearances, they were close to nil. When I adjusted them to factory spec, the compression jumped up to 140 per cylinder. This still seem a bit low compared to my other bikes.

What else, well the clutch is way to sticky, almost impossible to free the clutch plates, and the speedo and tach jitter too much.

That is all for now. I am looking forward to hearing and sharing info on our bikes.

-Pat
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

hi pat and welcome to TT im not a TSS owner but i have a sneaky suspition that some TSS owners will be along very soon ! you now who you are :y2:
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Hi, Pat and welcome to the forum. While I have zero experience with the TSS, I do have some experience with other Meriden Triumphs. The sticky clutch is a characteristic of the older Triumphs. The longer they sit, the worse they stick. As a matter of routine, I make sure my bike is in neutral, pull the clutch lever in and kick the bike over until the clutch is free.

Congratualtions on a very rare bike. I am :y154: Please post some pics. And include pics of the rest of your fine stable.
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Hello Pat and welcome.

Your TSS sounds great. Nice to get an original. As you know I have just finished restoring mine and today was its first day out on the road as it is now registered. I did about 75 miles and I concur. The gauges are a bit jittery. I strapped my GPS on and the speedo is surprisingly accurate. My clutch is typical Triumph and requires freeing up prior starting. Once warm it has a very smooth action. The engine is particularly smooth. At 3500rpm (about 60 mph) it just purrs. Vibration is conspicuously absent for a British twin. Running the engine in, so 3500 rpm is maximum for the moment. No smoke and no oil leaks so all is on track.

Am looking for valve timing information for you. One plus with removing the electric start and changing the timing cover, is that a Morgo rotary pump will then fit. Huge weight saving as well.

Will run my bike tomorrow and give it a compression test so that you can compare cylinder pressures.

All the best
SD
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Hello All,
I saw this interesting thread on google regarding the Triumph TSS, so I made the arduous effort of joining Triumph_Talk to hopefully share some info on these interesting motorcycles.

I am the second owner of a 1983 TSS; I made the irrational purchase about two years ago.
For those of you who remember, in the early 1980's, new 4 valve Triumph's were still on showroom floor, but they had very little that was new to offer, or even better than the older models, and the competition was moving on. I remember a new TSS on the showroom floor of Britalia motors in San Jose. It really looked good, and anything of significance would have been enough, but there was dreadfully little info, then and now, regarding the 8 valve triumph. Even to this day, I have never seen a TSS on the road or even in display, excpept for mine.

A quick summary of my bike. I am the second owner, the bike was meticulously maintained, it looks almost brand new, despite having 17,000 miles.
The modifications that the previous owner made are as follows: progressive fork springs, and a slightly larger rear sprocket. It still has the original front tire.

My time working on the bike has been somewhat limited lately due to work and other things, but here is where I currently am on this bike: The electric start worked great for a week and then stopped. After removing the timing cover to inspect, I saw that the sprague clutch was shot. When I removed the timing cover, the intermediate gear fell off revealing a chip in both the intermediate gear and crank pinion. I replaced the crank pinion, however, the intermediate gears are absolutly unobtainable, at least not from any of my sources. I am in the process of converting to a non-electric start timing cover, but I don't trust the timing marks on the timing gears. Does anyone have the cam specs for this bike? I cannot find them anywhere.

Despite the good condition of the bikes external finish, the compression seemed low, about 100-110 per cylinder; however, it does not smoke. When I inspected the valve clearances, they were close to nil. When I adjusted them to factory spec, the compression jumped up to 140 per cylinder. This still seem a bit low compared to my other bikes.

What else, well the clutch is way to sticky, almost impossible to free the clutch plates, and the speedo and tach jitter too much.

That is all for now. I am looking forward to hearing and sharing info on our bikes.

-Pat

Welcome Pat

Good to here of another "Rare" TSS owner:y2:

I have the TSS Manual (well suppliment) and there is no reference to valve timing being different? of course Truimph manuals are know to omit critical information. The data section states "For data not listed refer to T140 1980/81.

Happy to e-mail you manual suppliment if you need it?

Cheers

Mike
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Did a compression test today. Leftee 152 psi, rightee 150 psi. Engine at operating temp, throttle wide open and cranked over using starter motor.

Sea Dog
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Regarding the sticky clutch plates. Apparently the 7 plate conversion cures this. Anyone had any experience with these.

SD
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Regarding the sticky clutch plates. Apparently the 7 plate conversion cures this. Anyone had any experience with these.

SD


Hi SD



Yes, I fitted a 7plate clutch and alloy pressure plate on my T140D and was very impressed withit. The plate kit came from LP Williams and the pressure plate from SRM in theUK, they were a bit expensive at the time but not so now. Clutch never stuck again and was at least 50% lighter.

The T140D was really bad for the clutch sticking, even aftergood rind and then sitting for 10mins, I later came across a Triumph service bulletinfor a recall on the 79 bike if they had this problem ( a batch of dodgy clutchplates I believe) so changing the plated for a modern quality set should help.

BTW, very envious you have the TSS on the road, stillanother 3 weeks before mine is even in the country! Are you happy witheverything so far?



Mike
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Welcome Pat

Good to here of another "Rare" TSS owner:y2:

I have the TSS Manual (well suppliment) and there is no reference to valve timing being different? of course Truimph manuals are know to omit critical information. The data section states "For data not listed refer to T140 1980/81.

Happy to e-mail you manual suppliment if you need it?

Cheers

Mike


Thank Mike,

You may be right, and I hope you are, but I am not sure. I would think that to take advantage of a more modern combustion chamber, twice as many valves, and a significantly retarted ignition timing, that the cam lift and timing would aslo be modified. Were cam designs at that time developed from trial and errror, or did the Triumph engineers develop a profile utilizing their slide rules; I suspect a little bit of both. I would be interested in what the Triumph experts think regarding this question.
\
-Pat

-Pat
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Hi Mike,

Thanks for the info on the clutch. Was thinking of converting mine to a 7 plate. To achieve the lighter action, are the springs replaced? What benefit is the alloy pressure plate?

Very happy with the TSS on the road. The engine impresses. I believe the benefits of the better breathing head are felt above 4000 rpm. Haven't gone there yet. It idles very nicely and very clean off idle. Engine is quiet and smooth. Gearbox shifts well, clutch operates smoothly (just a bit of a job when cold to free the plates). The twin disc brakes work surprisingly well. I was out on my Street Triple R yesterday, which feels so refined, responsive, light and quick by comparison. Motorcycles have come a long way in 30 years. Really enjoy the character of the TSS though. Feels so solid. No need to tear up the tarmac to enjoy the ride. Pulls a crowd of admirers too! The ribs on the standard Doherty hand grips are shockers. A lighter throttle action would go a long way to curing this. Seat is plush. Foot peg position feels like a cruiser compared to the Street Triple. I see why the other Bonnevilles for the US market had higher more pulled back bars. It suited the foot peg position better. The suspension soaks up the bumps well. When I stripped the forks to replace the stanchions, I discovered it had progressive springs.

All in all, the TSS exceeds my expectations on the road.

SD
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Hello All,
I saw this interesting thread on google regarding the Triumph TSS, so I made the arduous effort of joining Triumph_Talk to hopefully share some info on these interesting motorcycles.

I am the second owner of a 1983 TSS; I made the irrational purchase about two years ago.
For those of you who remember, in the early 1980's, new 4 valve Triumph's were still on showroom floor, but they had very little that was new to offer, or even better than the older models, and the competition was moving on. I remember a new TSS on the showroom floor of Britalia motors in San Jose. It really looked good, and anything of significance would have been enough, but there was dreadfully little info, then and now, regarding the 8 valve triumph. Even to this day, I have never seen a TSS on the road or even in display, excpept for mine.

A quick summary of my bike. I am the second owner, the bike was meticulously maintained, it looks almost brand new, despite having 17,000 miles.
The modifications that the previous owner made are as follows: progressive fork springs, and a slightly larger rear sprocket. It still has the original front tire.

My time working on the bike has been somewhat limited lately due to work and other things, but here is where I currently am on this bike: The electric start worked great for a week and then stopped. After removing the timing cover to inspect, I saw that the sprague clutch was shot. When I removed the timing cover, the intermediate gear fell off revealing a chip in both the intermediate gear and crank pinion. I replaced the crank pinion, however, the intermediate gears are absolutly unobtainable, at least not from any of my sources. I am in the process of converting to a non-electric start timing cover, but I don't trust the timing marks on the timing gears. Does anyone have the cam specs for this bike? I cannot find them anywhere.

Despite the good condition of the bikes external finish, the compression seemed low, about 100-110 per cylinder; however, it does not smoke. When I inspected the valve clearances, they were close to nil. When I adjusted them to factory spec, the compression jumped up to 140 per cylinder. This still seem a bit low compared to my other bikes.

What else, well the clutch is way to sticky, almost impossible to free the clutch plates, and the speedo and tach jitter too much.

That is all for now. I am looking forward to hearing and sharing info on our bikes.

-Pat

Hello again Pat.

Trying to investigate the reason your starter clutch failed. I feel I am sitting on a time bomb with my one. Did the rollers inside the starter clutch break ? At the time the starter clutch failed, did the engine kick back on compression ?

SD
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Hi Mike,

Thanks for the info on the clutch. Was thinking of converting mine to a 7 plate. To achieve the lighter action, are the springs replaced? What benefit is the alloy pressure plate?

Very happy with the TSS on the road. The engine impresses. I believe the benefits of the better breathing head are felt above 4000 rpm. Haven't gone there yet. It idles very nicely and very clean off idle. Engine is quiet and smooth. Gearbox shifts well, clutch operates smoothly (just a bit of a job when cold to free the plates). The twin disc brakes work surprisingly well. I was out on my Street Triple R yesterday, which feels so refined, responsive, light and quick by comparison. Motorcycles have come a long way in 30 years. Really enjoy the character of the TSS though. Feels so solid. No need to tear up the tarmac to enjoy the ride. Pulls a crowd of admirers too! The ribs on the standard Doherty hand grips are shockers. A lighter throttle action would go a long way to curing this. Seat is plush. Foot peg position feels like a cruiser compared to the Street Triple. I see why the other Bonnevilles for the US market had higher more pulled back bars. It suited the foot peg position better. The suspension soaks up the bumps well. When I stripped the forks to replace the stanchions, I discovered it had progressive springs.

All in all, the TSS exceeds my expectations on the road.

SD

Hi SD

To be honest about the alloy pressure plate, I can be prone to buying shiny bits for my bike from time to time:y12: without adequate research....

They are lighter and far easier to true up, I did replace the springs with uprated ones from British Spares as I recall the original springs were at minimum length. The SRM alloy plate has a bearing that the push rod sits against (this required a bit to be cut off the push rod) so not such a big deal if you sit running with the clutch pulled.

Another thing that is worth considering, i used to use general 20/50w oil (quality brand of course for my babies) and sombody told me to use motocycle specific 20/50 (somthing to do with the additives) as the stuff for cars (say Castol GTX 20/50) does not help with the sticking clutch. I did try this on another Bonneville I had and it did make a difference and appeared to improve with oil changes? bike has since been sold so no long term results are avalible:y9:

I would start with the 7 plate convertion and see how it goes, I think British Spares do a set for around $180.


BTW I'm also jelous that you have a Street Triple R as well as a TSS!!! That wife that you had to by the car for, she wouldn’tbe Elle McPherson by any chance:y8:

Cheers

Mike
 
Re: 1983 Triumph T140W 750 TSS; 8 valves & electric start! - GrandPaul

Hi SD

To be honest about the alloy pressure plate, I can be prone to buying shiny bits for my bike from time to time:y12: without adequate research....

They are lighter and far easier to true up, I did replace the springs with uprated ones from British Spares as I recall the original springs were at minimum length. The SRM alloy plate has a bearing that the push rod sits against (this required a bit to be cut off the push rod) so not such a big deal if you sit running with the clutch pulled.

Another thing that is worth considering, i used to use general 20/50w oil (quality brand of course for my babies) and sombody told me to use motocycle specific 20/50 (somthing to do with the additives) as the stuff for cars (say Castol GTX 20/50) does not help with the sticking clutch. I did try this on another Bonneville I had and it did make a difference and appeared to improve with oil changes? bike has since been sold so no long term results are avalible:y9:

I would start with the 7 plate convertion and see how it goes, I think British Spares do a set for around $180.


BTW I'm also jelous that you have a Street Triple R as well as a TSS!!! That wife that you had to by the car for, she wouldn’tbe Elle McPherson by any chance:y8:

Cheers

Mike

No chance. Elle would have cost me a Porche, the house and leftee !
 
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