Faulty Clutch, crunching gears

[T90 Arrow]

Hi all, sorry if you have read this elsewhere but I'm trying to get advice from the masses.
I recently bought a 67 T90 and after sorting it cosmetically I'm now looking at the oily bits. The bike won't go from neutral to 1st or neutral to 2nd without a real crunching of the gears. Once in gear the clutch works fine although I've only riden it into the garage. I've stripped the clutch and cleaned up the gunged up plates after standing for a while. The clutch basket has no sideways or in and out movement but wobbles about when the clutch is disengaged.I have been told this is normal. Anyway I replaced the rollers and thrust washer just to see if it helped but it still wobbles about.I have centralised the clutch and it is running true. I put it back together tonight and it is no better.
I'm not the most experienced of mechanics so am I missing something obvious. The clutch operation is smooth and easy to pull in with no sticking or clicking to indicate badly aligned plates. Can I start the bike with the primary chaincase off to see if I can see anything dodgy.
Thanks Barry

 

[The Seeker]

I would say you can start the bike with the chaincase off as long as it isn't too awfully long. The oil inside should have enough coating to last for at least a brief time.

 

[grandpaul]

You can run a chain primary drive for an hour and not hurt it.

Did you check your clutch basket grooves for "rippling", where they have jagged edges instead of smooth sides?

You've got to do a completely proper total adjustment as follows (by the book):

Set the clutch pressure plate springs where they take about 5 turns in from the point where they start making thread contact (as a starting point). Give each spring one turn, then proceed to the next, to do them up evenly.

Loosen the clutch cable up at the lever adjuster and at the bottom end.

Position the bottom actuator arm in the tranny cover to the point where it is not flopped down.

Unlock the pressure plate center setscrew locking nut and loosen the grub screw out, then back in to a point where it just makes contact with the pushrod. Back it out 1/4 turn, and lock the locknut down snugly.

Adjust the bottom cable adjuster to the point that the slack is taken up inside the tranny case.

Adjust the top cable adjuster at the lever to leave no more than 1/8 - 1/4" slack in the lever.

SHOULD BE good to go.

If you still get gear graunching, TIGHTEN the pressure plate adjuster springs in one more turn each, and test again. Make sure to re-adjust the center screw to maintain 1/4 turn out from touching the pushrod, and the slack in the cable, every time you adjust on the pressure plate screws.

At some point, the action will get better. You might want to try half-turns on the pressure screws to moderate grab -vs- slip, because at some point in either direction you will reach those two extremes.

 

[T90 Arrow]

Hi all, thanks to those who replied to my clutch problems on my recently purchased 1967 T90, just an update. I asked for advice from several sites including this one. These were the replies.

Check none of the plates were misssing, they were flat not buckled,
Check the groves in the basket and the hub, no sharp edges.
Take time to set up the clutch run out, one sixteenth of an inch of thread showing as a starting point.
Use thinner oil, ATF, and don't overfill.
One I haven't tried yet was about the split pins for the selector plungers wearing and allowing the plungers to foul the camplate.

Anyway the upshot was that it was only a fraction better. As a last resort I got someone to have a quick look who has owned classics all his life. He looked at it, fiddled with it and said it was one of the best set up Triumph clutches he has seen "Just bang the f*****g thing in gear. Apparently I was trying to ease it in. Anyway I've just taken it for it's first ride and it wasn't as bad as I thought. Actually coming back down the box it was quite smooth (ish). Going up it is a question of (as one or two people suggested) taking your time and letting the gearbox revs slow a little before changing up.

Ho Hum, you learn by your mistakes.
Thanks again, Barry

 

[CarlS]

Thank you for the followup report. Those older Triumph trannys are clunky - as were most other trannys in the day. The advice you got is spot on. Just ride it and enjoy it.