1983 T140W TSS

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As to the Podtronics, I am looking into them on line for about $75. This rectifier/regulator will replace the zener diode and Lucas rectifier correct? Any particular model?
You will need the three phase Podtronics version with three yellow wires that connect to the three wires from the alternator and a black red that goes to the battery. Wassell also make one similar that will be a bit cheaper if cost is an issue. It is unlikely that a faulty Zener would prevent it from starting, unless it is shorting out and hence blowing the main fuse. Good luck for when it arrives.
 
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Looking at the Podtronics rectifier/regulator from ClassicBritishSpares.com their 3-phase photo shows only 2-yellow wires, a black & red. Do I need the 3-yellow wire version? Apologize for lack of electrical knowledge…
 
The text refers to two or three wire alternators. You want the three phase three wire unit

Lucas Rectifier / Regulator Units - Choose From Single & Three Phase

"The three phase Lucas regulator is rated up to 240 watt which is standard for most 12 volt Triumph, BSA, and Norton motorcycles fitted with a three phase alternator. The three phase Lucas regulator will work with 3-wire 12 volt stators either positive + ground or negative - ground.


You must run a battery when using the Lucas three phase regulator. A detailed instruction slip will be supplied to assist you during installation. Works with both points ignition and electronic ignition."
 
The text refers to two or three wire alternators. You want the three phase three wire unit

Lucas Rectifier / Regulator Units - Choose From Single & Three Phase

"The three phase Lucas regulator is rated up to 240 watt which is standard for most 12 volt Triumph, BSA, and Norton motorcycles fitted with a three phase alternator. The three phase Lucas regulator will work with 3-wire 12 volt stators either positive + ground or negative - ground.


You must run a battery when using the Lucas three phase regulator. A detailed instruction slip will be supplied to assist you during installation. Works with both points ignition and electronic ignition."
Awesome, thanks! Just purchased the 3-phase 240 watt on eBay. The picture showed 3-yellow, a black and red wires for a total of 5 wires. Many questions I know just wonder why some PodTronics are only 4 wires, 2-yellow, a red and a black. Will study the manual when I pick it up tomorrow.
Have a great night, day or wherever you may be!
 
The TSX is still a wonderful bike. It doesn't have the 4 valve per cylinder set up of the TSS but is still quite a rare machine and well worth putting back on the road.
 
Forgive my lack of knowledge
I have locked the thread because:-

. You are not interpreting posted advice correctly.

. Some of the posted advice is poor.

Please read this post carefully; when you have understood my advice, contact me using a private message (called a "Conversation" on this forum, click on the 'closed envelope' icon top right of the webpage) and I will reopen the thread.

Just purchased the 3-phase 240 watt on eBay.
I advise you to cancel the purchase:-

. You have not posted any information on what the problem is with the bike. You do not even have the bike.

. Fitting any reg./rec. requires changing the bike's wiring. Ahead of knowing the existing problem with the bike, what are you going to do with a new reg./rec., tear into the bike's wiring anyway? You have already posted you lack knowledge; without knowing the existing problem, why change the bike's wiring to fit the reg./rec., with the potential just to add more problems? :confused:

. Depending on what the problem turns out to be, a new reg./rec. might be a solution. However, the "Lucas" reg./rec. you have bought is one of the least reliable of the available reg./rec.; imho not worth the money. There are more reliable reg./rec. (Podtronics) and there are reg./rec. available on Ebay that are both more reliable and cheaper.

Aside, be aware the company that uses the "Lucas" branding today to supply electrical parts for old vehicles never had anything to with the original Lucas company that supplied your bike's electrics to Triumph; the modern company - Wassell - simply pays the "Lucas" rights owner to use the branding. Wassell also uses a number of other names of old British components companies - e.g. "Girling" for the brake parts it offers (although "back in the day" Girling never supplied anything to Triumph except rear suspension units). Why Wassell does this instead of using its own company name on its products is open to speculation, the hope is Wassell does not intend to mislead customers without the knowledge above? :cool:

turns out the bike is a 1983 T140 TSX.
Please reread my post #2 and my post #14 in this thread. Most of the information in them also applies to a TSX. The only component that might be different on a TSX - if the bike does not have an electric starter - is the original alternator might have been the "low output" version (the original Lucas company rated "low output" as 10.5 Amps at 5000 rpm).

Nevertheless, the original alternator was still 3-phase, a 1983 TSX would have had the same 3-Zener strip as a TSS, each Zener connected to one of the AC wires between alternator stator and original rectifier.

It is unlikely that a faulty Zener would prevent it from starting, unless it is shorting out and hence blowing the main fuse.
(n) This information is simply wrong for either a TSX or a TSS. This is the worst example of the poor advice that has been posted in this thread, that has led you to the potentially unnecessary purchase of a reg./rec.

The bike
has been sitting WAY too long. Seems the Zener Diode is the issue
Although you do not have the bike yet, because of the incorrect, poor and misleading information that has been posted in this thread, I will speculate on the symptom that might have led to "Seems the Zener Diode is the issue":-

. British bikes built up to some time during 1980 were fitted as standard with a single Zener diode connected across the battery (e.g. the "‘73 650 Bonny" that someone tried to sell you). If that single Zener fails closed, it makes a short circuit between battery negative and battery positive, that blows the fuse also connected between battery negative and battery positive. (n) This fault is well known on British bikes built up to some time during 1980.

. As is already in my post #2 for you, during 1980, Lucas stopped supplying/Triumph stopped fitting the single Zener diode connected across the battery. Instead, a strip of three Zeners was fitted, one connected to each wire between the alternator and the rectifier; as these connections are NOT between the battery terminals, one of these Zeners failing closed essentially cannot cause the fuse - connected between the battery terminals - to blow.

. I.e. if the reason for a 1983 TSX (or TSS) "sitting WAY too long" is the fuse blows persistently, the cause cannot possibly be a failed single Zener diode connected across the battery.

. Unless a DPO (Dreaded Previous Owner) has messed with the bike's electrics so badly that a pre 1980 wiring harness - with a single Zener diode connected between the battery terminals - had been fitted to the bike. :eek:
 
I have locked the thread because:-

. You are not interpreting posted advice correctly.

. Some of the posted advice is poor.

Please read this post carefully; when you have understood my advice, contact me using a private message (called a "Conversation" on this forum, click on the 'closed envelope' icon top right of the webpage) and I will reopen the thread.


I advise you to cancel the purchase:-

. You have not posted any information on what the problem is with the bike. You do not even have the bike.

. Fitting any reg./rec. requires changing the bike's wiring. Ahead of knowing the existing problem with the bike, what are you going to do with a new reg./rec., tear into the bike's wiring anyway? You have already posted you lack knowledge; without knowing the existing problem, why change the bike's wiring to fit the reg./rec., with the potential just to add more problems? :confused:

. Depending on what the problem turns out to be, a new reg./rec. might be a solution. However, the "Lucas" reg./rec. you have bought is one of the least reliable of the available reg./rec.; imho not worth the money. There are more reliable reg./rec. (Podtronics) and there are reg./rec. available on Ebay that are both more reliable and cheaper.

Aside, be aware the company that uses the "Lucas" branding today to supply electrical parts for old vehicles never had anything to with the original Lucas company that supplied your bike's electrics to Triumph; the modern company - Wassell - simply pays the "Lucas" rights owner to use the branding. Wassell also uses a number of other names of old British components companies - e.g. "Girling" for the brake parts it offers (although "back in the day" Girling never supplied anything to Triumph except rear suspension units). Why Wassell does this instead of using its own company name on its products is open to speculation, the hope is Wassell does not intend to mislead customers without the knowledge above? :cool:


Please reread my post #2 and my post #14 in this thread. Most of the information in them also applies to a TSX. The only component that might be different on a TSX - if the bike does not have an electric starter - is the original alternator might have been the "low output" version (the original Lucas company rated "low output" as 10.5 Amps at 5000 rpm).

Nevertheless, the original alternator was still 3-phase, a 1983 TSX would have had the same 3-Zener strip as a TSS, each Zener connected to one of the AC wires between alternator stator and original rectifier.


(n) This information is simply wrong for either a TSX or a TSS. This is the worst example of the poor advice that has been posted in this thread, that has led you to the potentially unnecessary purchase of a reg./rec.


Although you do not have the bike yet, because of the incorrect, poor and misleading information that has been posted in this thread, I will speculate on the symptom that might have led to "Seems the Zener Diode is the issue":-

. British bikes built up to some time during 1980 were fitted as standard with a single Zener diode connected across the battery (e.g. the "‘73 650 Bonny" that someone tried to sell you). If that single Zener fails closed, it makes a short circuit between battery negative and battery positive, that blows the fuse also connected between battery negative and battery positive. (n) This fault is well known on British bikes built up to some time during 1980.

. As is already in my post #2 for you, during 1980, Lucas stopped supplying/Triumph stopped fitting the single Zener diode connected across the battery. Instead, a strip of three Zeners was fitted, one connected to each wire between the alternator and the rectifier; as these connections are NOT between the battery terminals, one of these Zeners failing closed essentially cannot cause the fuse - connected between the battery terminals - to blow.

. I.e. if the reason for a 1983 TSX (or TSS) "sitting WAY too long" is the fuse blows persistently, the cause cannot possibly be a failed single Zener diode connected across the battery.

. Unless a DPO (Dreaded Previous Owner) has messed with the bike's electrics so badly that a pre 1980 wiring harness - with a single Zener diode connected between the battery terminals - had been fitted to the bike. :eek:
Okay, felt like I got a good thrashing and maybe I needed it. Coming on as a “new” owner of this “revised” bike. Getting a reset, again. Yes, many have said ditch the Zener and get the PodTronics in which I have stated the wire configuration, which I have order already. The mech., is a small engine guy of high repute. Was shocked to find out that what I thought was the “TSS” turned out to be a TSX. The consensus seems that TSX is still a good purchase. Yes, I should have had eyes on the machine and not listened to the mech. Will get pictures and more details tonight. It was not abused and no tinkering by the mech. Not to mention, the woman who owned it maintained and loved it! Question still remains, is the TSX any lessor or greater value than the TSS?


Oops, turns out the bike is a 1983 T140 TSX. Is it better or a bigger problem? In the process of buying with $1500 in hand and feel like I’m on the edge. Any suggestions…?
Turns out the mechanic told me it was a TSS.
 
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