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Black Gold - Texas Tea: Oil - Too Much!
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Baldeagle
Member
Well hemi is right,at least you have got some out,may I be so bold as to ask if you tried to remove the sump plug by using the torque wrench?I am not being cheeky but I have limited strength in my arm due to shoulder surgery and it is amazing how much more purchase you can get,although not really proper usage it does sometimes work,have even been forced to use a scaffold pole on occasions,stupid!,no need to tighten so much.
I'm delighted to hear that you succeeded. I was quite certain you would, but that sure was a lot of oil!!! Way, way too much!
Cold oil doesn't flow that easily as you found out and that's what I meant earlier when I said it would be slow going.
Those sight glasses are such a PITA!! The bike needs to be absolutely vertical to get a true reading.
Obviously, the drain plug was far, far too tight. There is no reason or excuse for that. It should only be 25 Nm (18-19 foot pounds).
As hemi said, the more you do things like this (wrenching and also riding) the more you learn for next time.
We've all made these mistakes and learned from our experiences - and from the mistakes and experiences of others - so you're in good company.
Cold oil doesn't flow that easily as you found out and that's what I meant earlier when I said it would be slow going.
Those sight glasses are such a PITA!! The bike needs to be absolutely vertical to get a true reading.
Obviously, the drain plug was far, far too tight. There is no reason or excuse for that. It should only be 25 Nm (18-19 foot pounds).
As hemi said, the more you do things like this (wrenching and also riding) the more you learn for next time.
We've all made these mistakes and learned from our experiences - and from the mistakes and experiences of others - so you're in good company.
Blimey at this rate we'll all be coming to you on how to fix our bikes. 
Good for you, you've done more to Barney since you've had had him, than most people I've known do to theirs in years of ownership.
Good for you, you've done more to Barney since you've had had him, than most people I've known do to theirs in years of ownership.
Blimey at this rate we'll all be coming to you on how to fix our bikes.
I agree with MOT.We're enjoying the way you dive into these projects, figure them out and fix them.
You've earned much respect and admiration here
here here !!! agree with everything thats been said .........oh can you come and have a look at the gearbox in JCB tele handler ive lost 4th gear 
@Baldeagle & Rocky -- I wasn't able to get the drain plug to budge even a tiny bit, not even with a torque wrench or anything.
First, those wonderful Renntec crash bars are a mighty PITA when trying to work in tight quarters. I might have to take them off for the duration while changing the oil & filter, then reinstall them.
Second, I need to get the bike up a bit more so that I can work underneath it. 'Tis hard to get purchase on a bolt when you're lying on your back and it's 2 inches from your nose, LOL. I'm hoping to get a moto stand from a local store that's routinely on sale. That'll lift it about 30 inches into the air.
About getting the drain plug off -- I read on another forum about (1) using a Liquid Wrench-type fluid to penetrate the bolt and loosen it, and/or (2) using a rubber mallet to gently tap the wrench just a bit to get it to move.
The next step is to probably go to a moto shop and get them to do the first oil change, but leave the ^%$^&#* plug and filter torqued to specs so that I can do it myself next time.
I don't know if the bike has even had its 500-mile first oil change. I got Barney at 1500 miles in January 2016; he has 2500 on him now. I figure it can't hurt to change the oil sooner rather than later.
Any other suggestions on loosening the drain plug before I pull the plug (heh!) and go to a real moto mechanic?
First, those wonderful Renntec crash bars are a mighty PITA when trying to work in tight quarters. I might have to take them off for the duration while changing the oil & filter, then reinstall them.
Second, I need to get the bike up a bit more so that I can work underneath it. 'Tis hard to get purchase on a bolt when you're lying on your back and it's 2 inches from your nose, LOL. I'm hoping to get a moto stand from a local store that's routinely on sale. That'll lift it about 30 inches into the air.
About getting the drain plug off -- I read on another forum about (1) using a Liquid Wrench-type fluid to penetrate the bolt and loosen it, and/or (2) using a rubber mallet to gently tap the wrench just a bit to get it to move.
The next step is to probably go to a moto shop and get them to do the first oil change, but leave the ^%$^&#* plug and filter torqued to specs so that I can do it myself next time.
I don't know if the bike has even had its 500-mile first oil change. I got Barney at 1500 miles in January 2016; he has 2500 on him now. I figure it can't hurt to change the oil sooner rather than later.
Any other suggestions on loosening the drain plug before I pull the plug (heh!) and go to a real moto mechanic?
Rocky & MOT - Awwww, shoot, thanks for the kind words! Y'all have been so helpful to me that I feel ready to jump in and at least try to do some of the work myself! Your expertise and support - and that of all the Forum members! - is most appreciated!
Yes it seems that some people even some dealers think you need to tighten the filter and drain plug up to oblivion 
, i think your right let a garage sort it this time and then you can have a go next time when the damn things are at the right torq 
, i think your right let a garage sort it this time and then you can have a go next time when the damn things are at the right torq
The Harbor Freight lifts are a budget item, but a lot of people have them as I've noted on many forums I've frequented over the years.
They're intended for light duty work and you have to be very careful that you don't exert too much muscle while it's up in the air as the lift will flex and you don't want it to tip over.
When the lift is up it's quite top heavy so you have to be careful that you don't push it over or pull it over on you.
I don't know the relationship between the engine bars and the drain plug so can't offer much help.
But it seems to me that if you can get a good purchase on the drain plug with a wrench or socket you should be able to tap the end of the tool with a hammer (metal on metal for the shock value) and break the plug loose - that is if you have enough room to do that. It may take a fair whack (several) to break connection.
I don't think a rubber mallet will work because the plug is in there very tight and you need the shock value to jar it loose.
You shouldn't have to remove the bars to get the job done, but I don't have an image of the area to go by so that's just speculation.
Liquid wrench might work, but I'm sceptical. I think it's going to take a bit of brute force.
If there is any way to get a long handled breaker bar in there the extra leverage might help and only muscle is needed.
If there is room to work you could try slipping a length of pipe over the end of the tool for added leverage.
Good luck and be careful.
Oh yes, BTW, you shouldn't use a torque wrench to break loose tight nuts and bolts. Use a proper wrench/socket/breaker bar. Using a torque wrench in that manner is not good for the inner workings.
I know that people use them that way, but they're compromising the accuracy of the wrench. Use it only for what it was intended.
If the engine oil and service is unknown I would change both oil and filter and use that as a base line for further service.
They're intended for light duty work and you have to be very careful that you don't exert too much muscle while it's up in the air as the lift will flex and you don't want it to tip over.
When the lift is up it's quite top heavy so you have to be careful that you don't push it over or pull it over on you.
I don't know the relationship between the engine bars and the drain plug so can't offer much help.
But it seems to me that if you can get a good purchase on the drain plug with a wrench or socket you should be able to tap the end of the tool with a hammer (metal on metal for the shock value) and break the plug loose - that is if you have enough room to do that. It may take a fair whack (several) to break connection.
I don't think a rubber mallet will work because the plug is in there very tight and you need the shock value to jar it loose.
You shouldn't have to remove the bars to get the job done, but I don't have an image of the area to go by so that's just speculation.
Liquid wrench might work, but I'm sceptical. I think it's going to take a bit of brute force.
If there is any way to get a long handled breaker bar in there the extra leverage might help and only muscle is needed.
If there is room to work you could try slipping a length of pipe over the end of the tool for added leverage.
Good luck and be careful.
Oh yes, BTW, you shouldn't use a torque wrench to break loose tight nuts and bolts. Use a proper wrench/socket/breaker bar. Using a torque wrench in that manner is not good for the inner workings.
I know that people use them that way, but they're compromising the accuracy of the wrench. Use it only for what it was intended.
If the engine oil and service is unknown I would change both oil and filter and use that as a base line for further service.
An update on the oil situation --
I rechecked the oil to make sure it was within limits, and I'm happy to report that it's PERFECT.
But I wanted to tell y'all how I finally did it. I saw a YouTube video about checking a sight port, and the guy suggested using a smart phone camera to snap a photo of the gauge using a selfie stick. I thought that was a good idea, but I liked my tweak better.
I used an iPad and videoed the sight gauge. I set the iPad up at gauge level, very close to it, then flipped the iPad camera around so it was looking at the gauge. I propped up a small LED headlamp for a bit of extra light. I originally had two halogen work lamps pointed at the bike, but they cast too much glare onto the glass gauge.
I warmed up the bike for the requisite 5 minutes, then as it was doing its 3-minute cool down, wheeled it into the garage where the headlamp and iPad were in place.
Here's a 20-second YouTube video of the oil check. I put it up mostly to show how the iPad picture looks. You could also just use a smart phone or a regular digital camera set on video mode to do this. (Excuse the mumbling you might hear on the video. I should have stripped the audio but I forgot to.)
If you're a tall person or can easily balance your bike while kneeling down beside it, I'm jealous. Because I don't have a wheel chock set up yet, doing the oil check this way helped me out a lot.
Thanks, folks!
I rechecked the oil to make sure it was within limits, and I'm happy to report that it's PERFECT.
But I wanted to tell y'all how I finally did it. I saw a YouTube video about checking a sight port, and the guy suggested using a smart phone camera to snap a photo of the gauge using a selfie stick. I thought that was a good idea, but I liked my tweak better.
I used an iPad and videoed the sight gauge. I set the iPad up at gauge level, very close to it, then flipped the iPad camera around so it was looking at the gauge. I propped up a small LED headlamp for a bit of extra light. I originally had two halogen work lamps pointed at the bike, but they cast too much glare onto the glass gauge.
I warmed up the bike for the requisite 5 minutes, then as it was doing its 3-minute cool down, wheeled it into the garage where the headlamp and iPad were in place.
Here's a 20-second YouTube video of the oil check. I put it up mostly to show how the iPad picture looks. You could also just use a smart phone or a regular digital camera set on video mode to do this. (Excuse the mumbling you might hear on the video. I should have stripped the audio but I forgot to.)
If you're a tall person or can easily balance your bike while kneeling down beside it, I'm jealous. Because I don't have a wheel chock set up yet, doing the oil check this way helped me out a lot.
Thanks, folks!
Rocky,
Good points, all. I've seen the HF lift up close & personal at my friend's garage, holding a BMW 1200, and you're right, you wouldn't want to really lean on it. But for oil checks/changes, chain maintenance, etc., I think it would be great. It doesn't take up much space in the garage at all.
I used the wrong words when I said torque wrench on the plug, True, you wouldn't want to use a semi-precision tool to muscle something off. I'm going to get 3/8" and 1/2" breaker bars today.
My primary mission today, though, is to get out and ride until I run out of gas. (I'll have a 1-gallon plastic gas can on the back of the bike. Hope I don't fall, LOL!)
On my last ride, I got a flickering fuel light at 88 miles from my last fill-up. It was on steady by 105 miles. I've never done a proper mileage check, just relied on anecdotal internet advice of about 40 mpg. With a 4-gallon tank, duhhhh, that seems really early to have a fuel light on, even accounting for the reserve.
People don't lie on the internet, do they? It must be true if it's online!
Good points, all. I've seen the HF lift up close & personal at my friend's garage, holding a BMW 1200, and you're right, you wouldn't want to really lean on it. But for oil checks/changes, chain maintenance, etc., I think it would be great. It doesn't take up much space in the garage at all.
I used the wrong words when I said torque wrench on the plug, True, you wouldn't want to use a semi-precision tool to muscle something off. I'm going to get 3/8" and 1/2" breaker bars today.
My primary mission today, though, is to get out and ride until I run out of gas. (I'll have a 1-gallon plastic gas can on the back of the bike. Hope I don't fall, LOL!)
On my last ride, I got a flickering fuel light at 88 miles from my last fill-up. It was on steady by 105 miles. I've never done a proper mileage check, just relied on anecdotal internet advice of about 40 mpg. With a 4-gallon tank, duhhhh, that seems really early to have a fuel light on, even accounting for the reserve.
People don't lie on the internet, do they? It must be true if it's online!
that was quite an elaborate system, but I admire your initiative It's very risky to kneel by your bike and try to hold it vertical at the same time. I wouldn't do it.
That's what the lift is for, routine maintenance, etc., as you noted.
I don't rely on low fuel lights, etc., I always set the odometer back to zero at each fill-up and when it reads 125-140 miles (200-225 kilometers up here) I start looking for gas - or sooner if I'm in a remote area.
There are many wheel chocks on the market so it's just a matter of choosing one you like.
I have the Baxley Sport Chock which works very well.
Baxley Trailer Sport Chock
Last edited:
Baldeagle
Member
Well that's certainly inventive,I have just met my Bonnie and it hasn't turned a wheel since service before delivery,I could just about see the sight glass but hadn't run it as it was quiet early this morning and didn't want to wake the neighbours!!
I could hold the bike OK standing still but wouldn't want to scrabble around much but have a bike lift in Portugal or teach Andrea to spot it for me haha.
Will post some pics as soon as I have given her a bit of a clean up,sadly the new front tyre is loosing pressure so that's the main task for tomorrow,polish can wait!
I could hold the bike OK standing still but wouldn't want to scrabble around much but have a bike lift in Portugal or teach Andrea to spot it for me haha.
Will post some pics as soon as I have given her a bit of a clean up,sadly the new front tyre is loosing pressure so that's the main task for tomorrow,polish can wait!
It's very risky to kneel by your bike and try to hold it vertical at the same time. I wouldn't do it.
That's what the lift is for, routine maintenance, etc., as you noted.
I don't rely on low fuel lights, etc., I always set the odometer back to zero at each fill-up and when it reads 125-140 miles (200-225 kilometers up here) I start looking for gas - or sooner if I'm in a remote area.
There are many wheel chocks on the market so it's just a matter of choosing one you like.
I have the Baxley Sport Chock which works very well.
Baxley Trailer Sport Chock
Rocky -
that was quite an elaborate system, but I admire your initiative
My initiative was driven by sheer terror. Withdrawing 1.1L of excess oil from the tank tended to make me righteously compulsive until I knew the oil system was good to go. And I agree with you, trying to hold the bike upright with one hand and get an accurate reading without being squashed is very difficult. Scary!
I always reset the odometer as well. However, as a half-empty-time-to-refuel kind of person, I had never let the tank get low enough ever to have the fuel light come on. And after today's 120 mile ride, I realized that, as in many things, technique is everything. Generally when I fill up the tank, I do it until I can stick a pinky in the tank and feel gas. I didn't want the tank filled right up to the brim. But when trying to get an accurate readout of how many miles you have left, that semi-filled state matters a lot! I filled the tank today to the very bottom of that metal cage-structure in the fuel tank. My buddy and I hit the road after he got off work; I had a 1-gallon gas can strapped onto my bike. The fuel light didn't come on until 117 miles. I'll ride tomorrow in a protected area until I run out of gas, and get a good hack on it then.
That Baxley looks great!!
But I have a question for you: how much oomph do you need to remove it from the chock? Do you have to really muscle it backwards? I really like that it's sturdy enough that I wouldn't have to bolt it down to the garage floor or to a trailer. (Just use ratchet straps in the trailer - awesome!).Thanks!
I chose the Baxley because it has those "rubber" pads and doesn't slide across the smooth concrete floor when you ride or push the bike into it.
It takes a bit of muscle to back it out, but not that much. I think you can handle it easily enough.
If you can put Barney up on the center stand you can easily handle the Baxley. It doesn't take as much effort as that.
Hmmm, but I don't remember if Barney has a center stand or not so maybe that's not a good comparison.
Anyway, I'm pretty sure you can handle it.
If I'm out on the road and going to continue my journey immediately, I fill the tank tight up to the top. The level will go down soon enough as you ride.
If I'm not going to ride immediately, I allow some room for the cold gasoline to expand in the sun or warm air.
Too many times I've witnessed guys filling their tanks to the brim and then let the bike sit in the sun only to have a gas spill in short order.
There's nothing wrong with filling up frequently. It's a lot better than the alternative
It takes a bit of muscle to back it out, but not that much. I think you can handle it easily enough.
If you can put Barney up on the center stand you can easily handle the Baxley. It doesn't take as much effort as that.
Hmmm, but I don't remember if Barney has a center stand or not so maybe that's not a good comparison.
Anyway, I'm pretty sure you can handle it.
If I'm out on the road and going to continue my journey immediately, I fill the tank tight up to the top. The level will go down soon enough as you ride.
If I'm not going to ride immediately, I allow some room for the cold gasoline to expand in the sun or warm air.
Too many times I've witnessed guys filling their tanks to the brim and then let the bike sit in the sun only to have a gas spill in short order.
There's nothing wrong with filling up frequently. It's a lot better than the alternative
