Engine Ice

Triumph Motorcycle Forum - TriumphTalk

Help Support Triumph Motorcycle Forum:

This site may earn a commission from merchant affiliate links, including eBay, Amazon, and others.
Had a look at their site and there's no distributor for ZA anyway.
I doubt there is another name for it. Pity.
Trouble is though it comes diluted with ionized water so it's pretty heavy to ship.

...
 
I may be wrong, but heres a theory that i gathered reading over the years which could possibly mean that a product like this could do more harm then good. Whether i'm off base or not it may be worth considering. Engines are designed so that the optimum tolerances are obtained when the engine is at the temperature that they will typically be at with the cooling system temps at what they will be with the spec'd coolant. In other words, if you ran something like this and it kept your engine as much as 50 degrees cooler (as the product says) then your engine was designed to, your engine temp may not be at the optimal point so that the tolerances are where the parts were designed to run best and most reliably. For example, if the spec for piston to cylinder clearance was too small because the engine never warmed up enough to achieve that, there could possibly be long term wear to an abnormal degree or maybe even a seizure.

Again, just a theory, and i am also filling in between the lines somewhat. But the basic idea is something that i have read before. Just something to consider.
 
Dazco this sound like you may have something here. I think you also need to look at your environment and what your average temps are. Here we get very high temps in our summer. So would you in fact be bringing the temp down enough to still be running in its design temp?
 
I don't know Dave. Maybe thats true to some extent, but only ever having one water cooled bike i can only go by what water cooling is like in a car. and todays cars seem to stay at the same temp, at least according to the temp gauge, no matter what the weather is like. For example, my honda accord's temp gauge never moves even a fraction from where it always is no matter if it's 105 or 68 out. So it seems as tho the systems are so well perfected that they stay the same no matter the weather. That would even be a stronger case for the theory i stated. But again, i'm certainly no expert on this stuff at all. I'm just going by what i've read and seen in my cars. But it does seem right and i would definatly be leary about using that stuff unless it was a racing vehicle that was highly modded or such. Then it would vary from how the factory meant it to be used.
 
Cars are tested worldwide in all extremes of weather and temperatures....I'm not as sure if bikes are but I suspect so.

This thread also reminds me of an old Brit sports car I once owned which always had overheating problems on hot days even though everything was up to spec and all parts functioning correctly. I only drove it in the Summers so I thought I'd just remove the thermostat completely so the engine would always get maximum coolant flow.

Well, the engine then would overheat even on cooler days! So the regulation of the water flow is also important.

PS: The solution was to put the thermostat back in and put a switched electric fan in front of the radiator to boost the cooling on hot days.
 
Years ago, I read an article by Smokey Eunick on engine cooling. If you have never heard of Smokey, you have missed one of the truly great innovators and personalities in racing.

Firstly, it was his belief that there is no better medium for heat transfer than water.

These are some of his takes on temperature and thermostats. Heat is transferred from engine metal to the radiator by water molecules. When a thermostat is removed, water flows faster and more violently over the transfer surfaces (engine and radiator). If the molecules move too rapidly over the heated or radiating surfaces, efficient transfer cannot take place. Consequence is that the engine may actually run hotter.

If an engine is set up to run most efficiently at, let's say, 200 degress, changing only the thermostat will be detrimental to performance or longevity of the engine. Consideration must also be given to fuel delivery/jetting and possibly timing. If the thermostat is cooler, the engine set up will be too rich and the engine will load up with carbon. If the thermostat is too hot, the mixture will be too lean and engine life decreases.

In Smokey's day, they had to take all things into consideration and do it by hand. Today, our new vehicles have computers which can compensate for small changes in temperature, elevation, humidity, air and fuel delivery, etc. However, a change in hardware can drastically alter performance. For instance, if a 205 degree thermostat is replaced with a 180 degree, the computer is fooled into thinking that the engine is not yet up to temperature. The result will be a "too fat" mixture. Some automatic transmissions, particularly overdrives, will not function as intended until the computer tells them that the engine is up to temperature.

Ain't nuttin' simple.
 
In Smokey's day (and I greatly admire the man and have had the pleasure of meeting him), automobile engines were set up to produce power and torque. Today's engines are set up by the factories to meet emission standards and CAFE standards as priority one. Engine longevity is not a priority. Thus engines in cars, just like the engines in our Bonnies, are set up on the lean side. Lean = more heat. And today's engine's run thinner oils to increase fuel mileage which is not necessarily the best for engine life. Causing an automotive engine to run a tad more rich could be a good thing by causing it to run a little cooler and increases engine life. However, when you do that, as you mentioned, you could well upset the mapping and the operation of the tranny.

The bottom line is that engines are set up to meet government mandates and are not setup to deliver peak performance or protection to the consumer.
 
[quote author=fuzzy link=topic=223.msg12201#msg12201 date=1221599747]
"Genius" is just the tip of Smokey's iceberg.

I miss the old days.
[/quote]

When Smokey was building engines for Glen Roberts, his engines consistently pulled more HP on the dynos than did any of his competitors. "Smokey's Best Damn Garage in Town".
 
Smokey designed and built an engine that used exhaust heated fuel, higher intake air temperature and what he called a homogenizer, which looked like a turbocharger. I believe it was a SBC, built to basically stock specs and produced massive power and torque readings while running at a much higher temperature than even today's CAFE engines are being forced to run at. He believed that heating the fuel to around 400° allowed it to vaporize and mix with intake air, creating more efficient combustion than is even possible in today's lean burn fuel mashers. The basic design of this engine is listed with the US patent office. Auto manufacturers could be building these today and meeting CAFE standards with a long lasting and very reliable engine.They just don't want to. CAFE gives them license to build sh*tbox throwaway turds so we keep coming back for more.
Give me old stuff or give me death!
 
Sorry, I didn't see the link to this hot vapor cycle engine in the earlier post. I read about this in an old Hot Rod magazine from the early 80's. Just going from what's left of my memory on this.
The mind is a terrible thing.
 
Tend to think these new guys do know what they are doing but if Smokey had the stuff they have to work with pistons would probably be obsolete by now. On the other side I won a lot of snowmobile races one winter (and was often accused of cheating). simply by being rich and retarded. Brooke. And no, I am thinking of entering politics ....
 
Back
Top